Saturday, August 7, 2010

An American Shame

"I am not a good American...I prefer to form my own opinions" - George Carlin

65 years ago, the citizens of Hiroshima, Japan did not have the benefit of the information below...not that it would have done them much good.

The eventual casualties were estimated to be upwards of 160,000. Most of them civilians. Many, many, many of the deaths, slow and agonizing.

Regardless of which school of thought one is an adherent of...should we have, or should we not doesn't much matter to the dead.

Oh, incidentially...we have never apologized for this event to the Japanese.

And please, do not tell me about Japanese atrocities in China in the 30's and 40's. I will simply delete your comment because you obviously don't get the point of this post.


Sue said...

I'm one of those Americans who has no qualms about saying what we do now in war and what we did in the past CAN be shameful and an embarrassment. Sometimes war is warranted yes, but sometimes it's just playing GI Joe with the American soldiers and the globe...

No apology?? THAT is shameful. Our country has much to apologize for. I hate that we are warmongers and think we have to be the global police...

Punch said...

Keep the lid on the trash can. Now that is good advice for a nucular blast, and the head in the elbow thing, has to help out.
Thanks for the defense seminar.

RealityZone said...

Hiroshima, and Nagasaki had more to do with showing Russia who the boss was, than it was with defeating the Japanese and ending the war.

Just as the fire bombing of Dresden was in Germany. A city filled with civilians, No military facilities at all.

Many will say it was the only way to stop the war. To that I say bull shit.

Many will say the bombing of Dresden was pay back for the Germans bombing London.
To that I also say bull shit.

Harlequin said...

it continues to be horrific, those actions taken in the name of peace, prosperity and progress; how is it that lessons are not learned and innocents keep dying?

vigilance, vigilance...

Debra She Who Seeks said...

Let's hope that nuclear weapons are never used again. That would be the best tribute to Hiroshima and Nagasaki's suffering.

boomer bob said...

Las Vegas must've rated high in the usefulness of fingers n traffic.
There is no doubt that the Japanese could be ruthless people, just as there is no doubt that Americans can be the same.

Using the nuclear weapons against primarily civilians was an inexcusable atrocity perpetrated to show power to others that the Japanese. It was just convenient that the Japanese were a handy excuse.

We try everything in our power to prevent other "rogue nations" from obtaining nuclear arsenals, yet we've been the only ones who jumped to the opportunity of using such a hideous devise, not once, but twice. We wouldn't want the Ruskies to think we'd depleted our ability to do the same to them.

RealityZone said...

Weapons of mass destruction were there after we got there.


we haven't ever said I'm sorry for anything..not to the indians, not to the african/americans...the body.

Punch said...

Well it was not the American that did that stuff, it was the Europeans that came to America. The African tribes sold others africans to the Dutch who sold them to the English.

jadedj said...

Sue---A bit arrogant, isn't it. It is about how we are always right, and everyone else is wrong.

Punch---And don't forget to duck under your desk.

RZ---I agree. As to the Japanese, they really were trying through the Swiss to get us to the table to negotiate a settlement. We just flat out ignored them. And yeah, the Dresden bombing had no strategic advantage what so ever.

Harlequin---I have come to the conclusion that no matter what, we are going to find reasons to flex our military. As George Carlin observed, Americans love war. An understatement.

DSWS---If we have it, we'll use it.

boomer bob---Macho bullshit at it's finest.

RZ---I am going to get back to that, and check it out. Thanks for the connection.

YDG---It's cuz God's on our fucking side, you see. Good observation!

Punch---You are correct, it wasn't. The idea of Western "Civilization" is somewhat of an oxymoron, isn't it?

Mr. Charleston said...

It's strange to me that the greatest loss of civilian life in the BIG ONE was the bombing of Tokyo, where over 250,000 perished, and it's almost never mentioned. It was reported that the fire was so intense, the entire city was made of wood and bamboo, that the updraft would suck people off of their feet and into the fire from a hundred feet away.

I'm on the fence about the atomic bombing. I can see both sides of the argument. But I agree with Debra, let's hope it never happens again. although we all know it will.

jadedj said...

Mr. C---Yes, Tokyo, another horrifying event.

Well, I purposely tried to avoid discussion as to whether we should have or should not have used the Atomic Bomb. Because the fact is...well over 100,000 civilians died as the result. And then, two days later...we did it again. To say the end justified the means is the height of arrogance, I think. And the recorded facts are, we could have taken another route, but we choose to take this one.

Sorry, I don't agree one damned bit with the "we had to do it" argument. It was pay back for Pearl Harbor, pure and simple. And truly, while it was a dastardly deed (bombing Pearl, that is), our loses at Pearl were as follows:
* US Navy 2,008 KIA
* USMC 109 KIA
* US Army 218 KIA
* Civilians 68
So, which was the more dastardly deed?

We were itching to get in it, and this gave us our excuse.

mouse (aka kimy) said...

shameful seems like too mild of a word, doesn't it?

thanks for adding your voice to the chorus of those calling for peace and saying never again, never again.

great blog, thanks for commenting on the mouse and bringing my attention to you and your corner of cyberspace!!!

diane said...

I saw a beautiful japanese animated movie years ago, about the day of the bombing and what the people were doing with their day before the bomb hit. Then the horror of it. I wish I could remember the name of it.

PENolan said...

Some years ago, when Austin was still in elementary school, we were at the Ray Bradbury Science Museum in Los Almos ( docent who MC'd the movie portion had a helmet head of blue-gray hair and wore a square dancing skirt while she related facts and statistics. She had plenty to say about the troops in the Pacific and the war and stuff. When we were free to wander around the exhibits on our own, I took him over to the replica of Fat Man. We stood there a while, then I told him that any time somebody says, "It seemed like a good idea at the time," to remember Fat Man and Little Boy. Try to say, "Seemed like a good idea at the time," to the people of Nagasaki.

jadedj said...

mouse---Indeed it does.

I am glad that you stopped over, and am particularly appreciative of the encouragement.

diane---Long time not see! Not sure if the following on YouTube is the film you're referring to, but there are others at this site as well. Good to hear from you again!

Samuel said...

"Madness is rare in individuals - but in groups, parties, nations, and ages it is the rule."

jadedj said...

Samuel---You recent post, "I'm Never Wrong" also says much to this subject...that is, America is always right...never coming to terms with being wrong. Hell, if God is on one's side, how could one ever be wrong?

Thank you for your thoughtful comment.

Samuel said...

"Hell, if God is on one's side, how could one ever be wrong?"

That's why I like the first amendment and remembering that nationalism failed in the 20th century. Unless 2 world wars doesn't count as a failure.

jadedj said...

Samuel---The greatest plague on humankind, ever...religion, that is.

RealityZone said...

Opiate for the masses.

Religion is for those who are afraid of hell.
Spirituality is for those who have been to hell and back.

jadedj said...

RZ---And all for the benefit of those in control.